WEBVTT
00:00:12.000 --> 00:00:54.000
Peter Gottlieb: 18th Street. [long pause]
00:00:54.000 --> 00:01:00.000
Anonymous: All I ever said.
00:01:00.000 --> 00:01:07.000
Gottlieb: Say it. Not too far. Um, can you tell me where your parents were
born?
00:01:07.000 --> 00:01:30.000
Anonymous: Anywhere? In Virginia. I don't know just what part of Virginia.
[recording paused] They were born in Virginia.
00:01:30.000 --> 00:01:56.000
Gottlieb: But you don't know exactly what part. Anonymous: No. Gottlieb:
Do you know where your-- where your grandparents were from? Anonymous: No.
Gottlieb: Okay. Um, did you ever know them? Your grandparents? Anonymous:
No. Gottlieb: Can you tell me what kind of work your father did? Anonymous:
Farmer. Gottlieb: Uh huh. Uh. What kind of things did he raise?
00:01:56.000 --> 00:02:16.000
Anonymous: Corn. Tobacco. Peanuts, sweet potatoes. Cot-- Yeah. Cotton. All
kind of around vegetables and we have the-- had our own vegetables.
00:02:16.000 --> 00:02:18.000
Gottlieb: Did he sell some of this in order to make--
00:02:18.000 --> 00:02:21.000
Anonymous: No, just for our livelihood. Gottlieb: Uh huh.
00:02:21.000 --> 00:02:24.000
Gottlieb: What did he do with the tobacco?
00:02:24.000 --> 00:02:36.000
Anonymous: Well, he sell that. He-- He didn't grow much tobacco because he
didn't like it, but he was selling tobacco. But the other produce was for
our five.
00:02:36.000 --> 00:02:45.000
Gottlieb: Did he own his farm? Anonymous: No. Gottlieb: Was he a-- Was he
what they call a sharecropper or did he pay cash for it?
00:02:45.000 --> 00:02:59.000
Anonymous: No, he rent them. He wasn't a share, exactly a sharecropper.
[unintelligible] The share of property he owned. Yeah.
00:02:59.000 --> 00:03:05.000
Gottlieb: Yeah. I'm sorry. Could you repeat that?
00:03:05.000 --> 00:03:16.000
Anonymous: No. Now you won't. You ain't in it now.
00:03:16.000 --> 00:03:36.000
Gottlieb: Do you remember how large the farm was? How many acres?
Anonymous: Oh. Yeah. [unintelligible] Gottlieb: Just a small place.
00:03:36.000 --> 00:03:40.000
Anonymous: Yeah, small. He rented.
00:03:40.000 --> 00:03:45.000
Gottlieb: Did your mother ever work outside the home?
00:03:45.000 --> 00:03:56.000
Anonymous: Just through-- you know, she worked hard to give her children
and she worked on the farm and she had, you know, quite a few children.
00:03:56.000 --> 00:04:05.000
Gottlieb: Did she ever take in laundry or anything like that to earn
money? Anonymous: No. Gottlieb: How many children did your parents have?
00:04:05.000 --> 00:04:10.000
Anonymous: 13, but they only raised eight.
00:04:10.000 --> 00:04:24.000
Gottlieb: That would mean five of them died as very young. And which of
the eight are you-- the oldest? Anonymous: I'm the third. Third. Gottlieb:
Um, how many were boys and how many girls?
00:04:24.000 --> 00:04:29.000
Anonymous: We had-- Um, those were the ones that had died.
00:04:29.000 --> 00:04:32.000
Gottlieb: If you-- if you can remember, even those who died then.
00:04:32.000 --> 00:05:01.000
Anonymous: Of the boys, five boys. Been so long. I forgot everything. They
had-- Nathaniel, and Matthew, that's two, [unintelligible], that's four,
Eugene and Wile, that's six.
00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:14.000
Gottlieb: Six-- Six boys? Anonymous: Six boys.
00:05:14.000 --> 00:05:47.000
Anonymous: And count more of the other ones. Ruth and Naomi. Ruth and
Naoimi. And Julia. That's two girls, and that's six girls. To. To. I asked
you to play this tape over. This is just for your information.
00:05:47.000 --> 00:06:11.000
Gottlieb: Did anybody else live with you and your parents when you were
growing up? Any other relatives? Did any of your relatives besides
yourself, your brothers or your sisters or your mother, father, aunts or
uncles come up North at any time in their lives? Anonymous: Did what?
Gottlieb: Did they move North?
00:06:11.000 --> 00:06:32.000
Anonymous: No. Well, yes, yes. My brothers, I had two brothers and one is
still here. But they were all grown. Cause they wasn't young and it wasn't
oldest one. I was 26 years old. One was 19, one was 18.
00:06:32.000 --> 00:06:42.000
Gottlieb: When they moved? Anonymous: They moved. Gottlieb: Um, what what
part of the North did they move to?
00:06:42.000 --> 00:06:51.000
Anonymous: Homestead and Pittsburgh and one was in Pittsburgh and one was
Homestead.
00:06:51.000 --> 00:07:00.000
Gottlieb: Would you remember roughly what year the year that was that they
moved up here?
00:07:00.000 --> 00:07:18.000
Anonymous: No I don't. All I remember say-- I might have it written down
somewhere, but I don't remember.
00:07:18.000 --> 00:07:26.000
Gottlieb: Was it before you came up that they moved or after you came?
Anonymous: After. Gottlieb: After you. Anonymous: After I.
00:07:26.000 --> 00:07:29.000
Anonymous: Was a few years after I came.
00:07:29.000 --> 00:07:44.000
Gottlieb: Do you remember why they came? Anonymous: No. They just. Why my
sister went home to visit, and they're not-- she already miss them [??]
00:07:44.000 --> 00:07:49.000
Gottlieb: Uh, can you tell me how much schooling you got in Virginia?
00:07:49.000 --> 00:08:04.000
Anonymous: Well, around, I went to the eighth grade. I didn't. I didn't
finish the eighth grade. Then I. Like I said, the seventh grade. Because I
go to eighth grade, I go to high school [??].
00:08:04.000 --> 00:08:09.000
Gottlieb: Do you remember the-- the school you went to?
00:08:09.000 --> 00:08:10.000
Anonymous: You mean the name of the school?
00:08:10.000 --> 00:08:19.000
Gottlieb: No. I'm talking more about just where it was, what kind of
building it was in, who was the teacher and that kind of thing.
00:08:19.000 --> 00:08:25.000
Anonymous: Yeah. There were some other teachers.
00:08:25.000 --> 00:08:48.000
Anonymous: Never frame build. Remember one, I remember one of the teachers
William Carpenter and one was named Solomon Vincent. And-- that's about
all. We didn't have a lot.
00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:57.000
Anonymous: We wasn't in school all the year round like these childrens
here. They've nothing to do but go to school and play.
00:08:57.000 --> 00:09:00.000
Gottlieb: What times of year did you go to school?
00:09:00.000 --> 00:09:37.000
Anonymous: In the fall or beginning in-- probably say November and maybe
part of December. See we have, we have work to do around the end of the
year. That gatherin' crop there, all like that, and then. Oh, January,
February, March and April. That was about the gist of our school. And we
had to, to then-- May
00:09:37.000 --> 00:09:55.000
Anonymous: And June, you know, we begin to get the farm together. Do the
work together. Everybody work, the children wouldn't play. Had a lot of
play like the children here. Everybody was big enough to work. They had to
work because that was our livelihood.
00:09:55.000 --> 00:10:01.000
Gottlieb: So about the time you would be old enough to be going to school,
you were old enough to do work on the farm too. Anonymous: Right. Gottlieb:
Uh huh.
00:10:01.000 --> 00:10:16.000
Anonymous: Um, see, we went school at age six. We didn't begin before we
were six years old. And that was those little jobs we could do at six years
old.
00:10:16.000 --> 00:10:19.000
Gottlieb: What-- What kind of things?
00:10:19.000 --> 00:10:30.000
Anonymous: Like feeding the chicken. Givin' corn to the pigs. Bringing in
water and bringing in the wood. You know, things like that.
00:10:30.000 --> 00:10:35.000
Gottlieb: What what part of Virginia did you grow up in?
00:10:35.000 --> 00:10:56.000
Anonymous: In-- I was born in Northampton, in Brunswick County, Virginia,
and then went from there, right down below Richmond in the country called
Valentines, Virginia. That's near Norfolk and [unintelligible].
00:10:56.000 --> 00:11:00.000
Gottlieb: And your parents lived in the same place all the time you were
growing up? Anonymous: Yes, all the
00:11:00.000 --> 00:11:03.000
Anonymous: time that I knew of them.
00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:08.000
Gottlieb: And something I often forget to ask married women. What was your
maiden name?
00:11:08.000 --> 00:11:14.000
Anonymous: Taylor. Gottlieb: Taylor. Okay. Um.
00:11:14.000 --> 00:11:22.000
Gottlieb: As you got older, did you have to do different things on the
farm than you were doing when you were just a young child? Did you get more
responsibility?
00:11:22.000 --> 00:11:49.000
Anonymous: Oh, yes. Yes. I could do more harder work. You know. Cook, take
you around, wood, you know, helped move wood on the cart or the wagon,
rather.
00:11:49.000 --> 00:11:54.000
Anonymous: I had heavier work when I got past six years old.
00:11:54.000 --> 00:12:03.000
Gottlieb: Did-- did the girls in your family do about the same kind of
work as the boys did, or was there a difference?
00:12:03.000 --> 00:12:33.000
Anonymous: No, those that were old enough, they did 'bout the same. I
mean, maybe the boys, they maybe the cut wood more, you know. We had knock
hard wood and it had to be cut in half. And I think I've seen woods cut in
all hair. Yeah.
00:12:33.000 --> 00:12:44.000
Gottlieb: Did you ever in Virginia have a-- have a job away from your home
where you were earning money before you came up North?
00:12:44.000 --> 00:12:51.000
Anonymous: Yes. For a little while. Not, not--Not long, because I was
needed at home.
00:12:51.000 --> 00:12:54.000
Gottlieb: Can you tell me what kind of job that-- Anonymous: I cooked.
00:12:54.000 --> 00:13:37.000
Anonymous: If I didn't cook, I didn't eat. That's what I tell you. If I
don't cook. I didn't eat. And. Then my-- my my hardest work. More work than
has ever been here. Surprising that. Really the hardest work or not. But,
you know, I've worked in that plant. The mill down on Felton Avenue,
Stanton, filling them with stamping concrete. Yeah, I've worked on that 21
years. Sometime I find I find that harder than some of the work that I
left.
00:13:37.000 --> 00:13:41.000
Gottlieb: You were cooking for a white family in Virginia? Anonymous:
Yeah. Gottlieb: Were you--
00:13:41.000 --> 00:14:04.000
Anonymous: This is where I cooked out. That was in North Carolina. The,
uh. Well, not too far from. North Carolina. Charles State [??].
00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:08.000
Gottlieb: How did you get that job?
00:14:08.000 --> 00:14:16.000
Anonymous: Well, they advertised for somebody.
00:14:16.000 --> 00:14:30.000
Gottlieb: So you would-- you weren't living with your family when you were
working? Anonymous: No, no. Gottlieb: Do you remember how old you were,
when you were-- Anonymous: About 20.
00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:34.000
Anonymous: 22 years old.
00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:41.000
Gottlieb: What would you have been doing with the money that you earned
cooking for the white man?
00:14:41.000 --> 00:14:48.000
Anonymous: Well, for my livelihood. I got clothes and food.
00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:55.000
Gottlieb: So you really were out on your own-- Anonymous: Yes. Gottlieb:
--at this time. Did you, uh, contribute anything to your-- To your
parents?
00:14:55.000 --> 00:15:09.000
Anonymous: Oh, yes, I did. I always did. Even when I came here. Always
helped. I feel like that-- Be sure, if I could.
00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:17.000
Gottlieb: Did your parents want you to leave home to take this job? Did
they encourage you to do it or was it your own desire?
00:15:17.000 --> 00:15:53.000
Anonymous: No, they just left to me. You know, we have around-- I was
grown up and have a livelihood. There's two wasn't two, wasn't like the,
you know, like a shady deal at the time because we were poor and sometimes
you on the farm. Sometimes you may even work. And then sometime you didn't.
There's only finally the year, the weather. And you know. You know.
00:15:53.000 --> 00:16:11.000
Anonymous: I didn't regret it. I love my whole life. I love-- I have no
difficult. I do. I didn't have to leave. And I come up on my own and nobody
paid my way. I come up on my own.
00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:18.000
Gottlieb: Did all your brothers and sisters leave your parents' farm when
they got to be of age?
00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:34.000
Anonymous: No, not all of 'em. Some of 'em still there. But they're not on
the farm. They don't farm anymore. But my mother and father were there.
They died, but they're still there. But not on the farm.
00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:38.000
Gottlieb: So some of them stayed and helped your father farm?
00:16:38.000 --> 00:17:07.000
Anonymous: They-- All this, boys and-- Ex old scar [??]. They stay here.
And then finally he stopped farming, you know, when he got too old. Well,
he had fun. But it's so easy sometimes.
00:17:07.000 --> 00:17:23.000
Gottlieb: You said you only had this job in North Carolina for a short
time. Do you remember how long it was that you were? Anonymous: About three
years. Gottlieb: About three years, you stayed there. And can you tell me
what you did after that?
00:17:23.000 --> 00:17:33.000
Anonymous: I came here. I came here and I still cook. I worked in a
restaurant.
00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:40.000
Gottlieb: How was it that you came to Homestead and not some other place
in Pennsylvania or in the northern states?
00:17:40.000 --> 00:18:08.000
Anonymous: Well, I-- I had people up here. I had acquaintance up here
and-- And-- and I come up on a visit and stayed. Yeah. I didn't know no
other place. Fact there was no other place and I left home. But when I
found it when I got here and I find out that the, uh.
00:18:08.000 --> 00:19:06.000
Anonymous: The wages where you work was a little more than they were in
the South. You know, it still wasn't three years, all I learned, it still
wasn't just up to par, but it was better. And the cost of living was not
quite as high back home as it was here. And now through the years, I found
some of the same thing here that I found in the South, maybe a little bit
more of some of the same thing. You may you think you have friends, you
think they they love you and. We talked about the white against the Black
and Black against the white.
00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:23.000
Anonymous: I find that no reflection on. Yeah, but I find that the, the,
the White in the, in the South, if they were your friends. And if they
loved you, they really were a friend to you.
00:19:23.000 --> 00:19:48.000
Anonymous: I find here that you're more on the same level and they don't
derive, you know you, you, you, you, you you think you're equal with them.
But in a way I in the South someplace youse a-- you're not quoting me.
You're not going to play this back with nobody else. You promise me.
Gottlieb: I promise you. Anonymous: Yeah.
00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:55.000
Anonymous: That, um, uh, they thought. I mean, you, you know, you-- you
wasn't equal.
00:19:55.000 --> 00:21:30.000
Anonymous: You wasn't equal to. But God made everybody the same question,
brother Black. No different. But you know they don't class you as being
equal with them. And there was no fights, no, uh, rioting like, like, like
we have here, you know, everybody. It was peaceful, you know, at your
place. You stayed in your place. I mean, this was my years. I don't know
how they do it now. And we didn't have all this fighting and and fussing
and breaking in, and-- and. Stealin' and workin' against each other. No, we
didn't have that. But here, because you have the same opportunity, if you
just watch for it. You know, you don't go and take somebody's, hand you
something on a silver platter. You have to work for it. And if you if you
qualify, you can demand, you know, certain things-- You're saying what I
mean. Gottlieb: Yeah. Anonymous: Certain thing. But. You didn't. You didn't
have it. It's freely. But I find we find some of the same thing to me, some
of the same defects here that we find inside. You would think, you know,
that the people in the South, how they come up and. It's muchdifferent here
now. Much, much better than worse. And they're out.
00:21:30.000 --> 00:21:45.000
Anonymous: I was out there last, I was 26 years old. Now I'm 78. Gottlieb:
Yeah, it has. Anonymous: Quite a change. So that's about all I have to tell
you.
00:21:45.000 --> 00:21:48.000
Gottlieb: Could I-- Do you mind if I ask you some more questions?
00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:51.000
Anonymous: Well, if I know the answer. Gottlieb: Okay.
00:21:51.000 --> 00:21:57.000
Gottlieb: Did you expect things to be better up here in Pennsylvania when
you left Virginia?
00:21:57.000 --> 00:22:14.000
Anonymous: No, I didn't. I didn't. I didn't come up expecting, you know,
anything to be better, although it was I find it and moving on through the
years, it was better. But I didn't come up because I didn't even come up to
stay.
00:22:14.000 --> 00:22:18.000
Gottlieb: Who was the friend that that you had here, that you knew here?
00:22:18.000 --> 00:23:00.000
Anonymous: There was around my-- my-- my brother. He was my oldest
brother. But he had he got sick. And there were some friends here in
Pittsburgh, the Johnsons. Nobody remind him like that. They were ten still
livin' at that. Charlie, Charlie Owen, Marjorie Owen. Shane. Say he was--
some of 'em's dead. Well, they were here, but I didn't leave or I didn't
leave to stay. Gottlieb: Yeah.
00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:04.000
Gottlieb: And all these people you knew from your home in Virginia.
00:23:04.000 --> 00:23:18.000
Anonymous: Because some of them was in North Carolina, but the state of
Virginia and North Carolina was-- You all in the state of North Carolina.
00:23:18.000 --> 00:23:22.000
Gottlieb: And-- and the reason you came up here was just for a visit.
00:23:22.000 --> 00:23:33.000
Anonymous: Yeah, in the-- That's why I didn't-- I didn't come to stay. But
when I got here, uh, I found that I really like stay a while. Gottlieb: Uh
huh.
00:23:33.000 --> 00:23:37.000
Gottlieb: And you didn't have any blood relatives up here at that time?
Anonymous: No.
00:23:37.000 --> 00:24:13.000
Anonymous: Well, this brother, I'll tell you, but he was over in-- He over
in Pittsburgh and he opened-- Columbia Hospital. So I come up on my own.
I've been-- paid my own way and come up on my own. Nobody sent for me and.
No trouble. I had no trouble, running away from nothing.
00:24:13.000 --> 00:24:22.000
Gottlieb: Uh, you had already left this job in North Carolina before you
made any plans to come up here? Or did you leave--
00:24:22.000 --> 00:24:29.000
Anonymous: No, I leave there. I left there. I went home to visit my mother
and--
00:24:29.000 --> 00:24:33.000
Gottlieb: But you knew when you left North Carolina that you were coming
up here or visit.
00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:34.000
Anonymous: I mean. Yes.
00:24:34.000 --> 00:24:37.000
Gottlieb: And you came to Homestead, not to Pittsburgh?
00:24:37.000 --> 00:24:57.000
Anonymous: No, not to Pittsburgh, Homestead. I lived, I lived in
Pittsburgh not too long. I lived all my life in Homestead. When I say all
my life. Well, I live the biggest portion of my life in a wheelchair.
00:24:57.000 --> 00:25:16.000
Gottlieb: You were-- you were 26 when you came up. Do you remember what
year that was? Anonymous: 1923. Gottlieb: When you decided to stay for a
while, were you going to stay with the same friends that you had been
living with? Anonymous: Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean.
00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:32.000
Anonymous: I mean, the woman is a stranger to me. I didn't know what. I
mean what-- I mean I met her. But the people that I roomed with, they--
They were-- I met them here. They were strangers to me. I never stayed with
my own.
00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:49.000
Gottlieb: You were-- You were single at this time? Anonymous: Yeah.
Gottlieb: Uh. Did you when you made up your mind to stay for a while? Did
you go out and try to find work right away?
00:25:49.000 --> 00:26:32.000
Anonymous: No, I didn't have to because the-- they, uh, the woman that
recommend me to, she had a restaurant and I went to, went to work, right?
And I leave. All I have done is, is work. But, I mean, they found a job and
didn't have much trouble getting the job and work. And they after my work,
after the church, take care of my house anyhow and I went to church. And
that's all. I don't know too much about the towns and the doings of the
town. You know, I don't know. Gottlieb: Yeah.
00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:36.000
Gottlieb: Did you mention the name Johnson? Was this the people who owned
the restaurant?
00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:40.000
Anonymous: No, they were Edmonds. Gottlieb: The Edmonds? Anonymous: Yeah.
And they both dead now.
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:48.000
Gottlieb: And that was right here in Pittsburgh. Anonymous: Right there
in-- Gottlieb: In Homestead. Anonymous: In Homestead. Gottlieb: Oh, and
they were Black people? Anonymous: Yes. Gottlieb: Do you remember where
their restaurant was?
00:26:48.000 --> 00:27:06.000
Anonymous: Was on Sixth Avenue. I don't know. I don't know the exact or
the number, but it was on Sixth Avenue. But we-- they lived, the home was
on up the hill on 12th and the business was on sixth.
00:27:06.000 --> 00:27:11.000
Gottlieb: Were they-- Were their patrons, both Black and white? That came
to the restaurant?
00:27:11.000 --> 00:27:16.000
Anonymous: Oh yes. More Black than white though.
00:27:16.000 --> 00:27:26.000
Gottlieb: Um. Mrs. Walker told me that your husband is in a nursing home,
and I knew I wouldn't have the opportunity to talk to him. But he, uh--
00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:57.000
Anonymous: Now he-- He was sick for a long time, and I'm sick myself. And
I had to put him, it isn't exactly a nursing home, is a foster home for the
aged. And I had put him there for a time being for me to heal, so I
couldn't take care of it. Gottlieb: Yeah. Anonymous: So. But I'm getting
stronger, the doctor said.
00:27:57.000 --> 00:28:03.000
Gottlieb: I was wondering if you could tell me a little bit about where he
came from and when he came up.
00:28:03.000 --> 00:28:12.000
Anonymous: Well, this is me. I don't really want to talk about him.
00:28:12.000 --> 00:28:20.000
Gottlieb: Okay. Did you use-- when you were living up here, did you-- were
you homesick for Virginia ever?
00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:48.000
Anonymous: Yes, I well, I did, but I went home every year. Gottlieb: Oh,
you did? Anonymous: Yeah. Yeah. And my mother and father died in 1958. One
died 58, in July. And my, uh. My father died same year in September. Okay.
And since I haven't been going back since I. Every year.
00:28:48.000 --> 00:28:50.000
Gottlieb: At the same time every year?
00:28:50.000 --> 00:28:57.000
Anonymous: Every year at the same time. July.
00:28:57.000 --> 00:29:11.000
Gottlieb: Um, can you tell me about the other jobs you had in-- in
Pittsburgh or in Homestead after you, um, finished, uh, at the restaurant.
00:29:11.000 --> 00:29:20.000
Anonymous: And, um. Yes, I, uh. You mean, I guess you're too young to know
anything bout the Depression?
00:29:20.000 --> 00:29:21.000
Gottlieb: Well, I didn't live through it.
00:29:21.000 --> 00:29:26.000
Anonymous: I-- Do you know anything about Depression here at Homestead?
00:29:26.000 --> 00:29:28.000
Gottlieb: Yeah, a little bit. From what people have told me.
00:29:28.000 --> 00:31:24.000
Anonymous: Yeah. Huh? I see. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I used to work before I
went down to the, uh, the, uh, Standard Government Factory. I worked, did
some day work. Over in-- You Jew? Gottlieb: Yes. Anonymous: You Jew? And I
worked, I mean, in there all over, uh, Squirrel Hill, mostly for the, uh,
the Jews and the Jews and some of the persecuted Jews. But I love the Jews.
They-- They-- They knew the oldest one, the Jew was the oldest one, and
they would give you a job to work, you know, didn't pay much, though, for a
dollar a day and coffee. But you would buy much more for a dollar then you
came here three time or $5 some time. And then I used to work with one of
them, she was Mrs. Nicholson. Now this is evening. And she would tell me to
to eat my breakfast at home and she would give me lunch. And then she go
home before supper. But she wanted me to stay wash the dishes, so. Because
the time was such a little bit of money and that's almost everything you
had. I got to stay and wash dishes, which could give me something to eat.
I'm hungry. And then-- and not too long then. And, you know, when the war
started. They started to hiring people. Of course, the men were living down
in this plant that fell on them and stamping company. They they turned it
to a plastic. Now, it's not a-- they don't make anything down there, now
they make plastic. Well, that's when I went down there to work and work
until I retired. 21 years. Gottlieb: Uh huh.
00:31:24.000 --> 00:31:27.000
Gottlieb: And you got that job during the war, you said. So those are--
00:31:27.000 --> 00:32:07.000
Anonymous: 1940 and 1944. 43. Yeah, 44. Because they have a policy down
there. They didn't hire colored folks. Gottlieb: Uh huh. Anonymous: And
then this was here in Pittsburgh. Now I got to tell someone, you know, you
find some depressing thing here. You fly down South. Yeah. And they, uh.
When-- when the boys all started going through the war, then they had a
hire whoever they could get. And then they start to hire.
00:32:07.000 --> 00:33:15.000
Anonymous: And I happen to get hired. Been there 21 years. And when some
of the girls have that job that I had some of them come back. Now they come
back in, the mill, American Bridge, the rubber plant. Was when the war was
over, they laid all these girls off. Down there, they lay us off. That was
that work there before they come back and want that job back. We found-- We
found favor with the bosses down there. They knew it wasn't right to give
them the job back. And we had our union, you know, and the union. It has
its disadvantages. And it's good, too, in a way, because there's 2 or 3
times a girls want to take my job because they were there before, but they
had went somewhere else and were laid off. But with senority here, they
couldn't do it. Gottlieb: Yeah.
00:33:15.000 --> 00:33:23.000
Gottlieb: So cooking and then working in Squirrel Hill and then at the
stamping plant were the three different kinds of work that you did.
Anonymous: Uh huh.
00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:59.000
Anonymous: Now see. With, with. With. With my cooking and that was just
cooking. Then work another one with this day work, that was washing
clothes and washing dishes and mopping floors and things like that. But
then when I went to McKees Rocks, the plant down there, I was a packer.
Start packin' things. Packin' away and ship.
00:33:59.000 --> 00:34:17.000
Anonymous: Well, that's where I stayed for 21 years. They pay-- They get
much more, much better now than they did when I left them 60 or 65.
00:34:17.000 --> 00:34:23.000
Gottlieb: Mhm. Did you lose your job at the restaurant because of the
Depression?
00:34:23.000 --> 00:34:52.000
Anonymous: No, no, no. You mean that I. That I worked there? Gottlieb:
Yeah. Anonymous: Uh, well. Well, in a way I did. Laundry-- But I just like
to work. I didn't have to go to work on account of Depression in the
beginning. But when. When I tell you about me working in Squirrel Hill and
this day's work, that was days the most of the time that I had to work.
00:34:52.000 --> 00:35:00.000
Gottlieb: Yeah. I was wondering, though, why you changed your job from the
cooking job to working in Squirrel Hill.
00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:03.000
Anonymous: Oh, she went out of business. Yeah.
00:35:03.000 --> 00:35:05.000
Gottlieb: Was that on account of the Depression?
00:35:05.000 --> 00:35:19.000
Anonymous: No, it was on account of her health got bad, and she couldn't--
Nobody would work. You know how that is. You couldn't get nobody that you
could trust to take care of the place.
00:35:19.000 --> 00:35:25.000
Gottlieb: Did somebody tell you about this job in the stamping plant and
did anybody help you get the job in any way?
00:35:25.000 --> 00:35:45.000
Anonymous: It was advertised in the paper and they wanted girls and I went
to an employment office and put in an application. Gottlieb: Uh huh.
Anonymous: That's how I have, uh, I've been blessed enough to probably be
on my own.
00:35:45.000 --> 00:35:48.000
Gottlieb: Were they hiring both white and Black women?
00:35:48.000 --> 00:36:57.000
Anonymous: Yes. And in the beginning, they only I mean, I don't know,
nothing real in the plant, but I mean, in the beginning. But I do know that
they had a policy to not to hire colored girls. But when the-- when the--
when the boys left, they had a lot of boys, and the boys left and the girls
left and went to go to in the mill and went to American Bridge and other
places they went for more money. They didn't pay much money down there.
They still don't pay now while we pay much more than they did. Because when
I first started working, I only got $0.43 an hour. And if I worked every
day and didn't lose no, no, no time, I had a $0.07 bonus, which made it
$0.50 hour. And so they left when they-- when they could get more money. I
was going to the mill myself, but I didn't have a Social Security card. And
when I got the Social Security card, then I had changed my mind and wanted
to go to mill.
00:36:57.000 --> 00:37:03.000
Gottlieb: Do you remember what union it was that had organized that
stamping plant? Anonymous: Oh.
00:37:03.000 --> 00:37:29.000
Anonymous: Mm. Name of the union. I have the card here somewhere, I could
tell you. No name of the union on there, is it?
00:37:29.000 --> 00:37:41.000
Gottlieb: No, this looks like an identification card from the company
because it just says Federal Enameling and Stamping Company.
00:37:41.000 --> 00:37:43.000
Anonymous: I have it somewhere.
00:37:43.000 --> 00:37:45.000
Gottlieb: Was it the Steelworkers?
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:57.000
Anonymous: Oh yeah. It was they all. We had the same union that the the
men work in the mill had.
00:37:57.000 --> 00:38:01.000
Gottlieb: Oh, well, then it was the Steelworkers. Anonymous: Uh huh.
Gottlieb: I know that. I know that much history.
00:38:01.000 --> 00:39:29.000
Anonymous: Yeah. Yeah. Gottlieb: Was it-- Anonymous: It was, uh. Can't
remember what my number was. 17. I can't remember. But anyway, we had the
same CIO union. You got have it here.
00:39:29.000 --> 00:40:12.000
Anonymous: Must have been in another place. Gottlieb: Was-- Anonymous:
Number 1578, you see?
00:40:12.000 --> 00:40:20.000
Gottlieb: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Was it organized when in the plant at the time
you started to work, or did it come in during the time you were there?
00:40:20.000 --> 00:40:35.000
Anonymous: Yeah, when I would have worked because I didn't want to. I
didn't want to join the union and is what you call the open plant. They
wouldn't give you the job if you didn't join the union. I'm glad I did
afterwards. Gottlieb: Yeah. Anonymous: Yeah, yeah.
00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:42.000
Gottlieb: Did you like working in that in the plant Better than you liked
working in people's homes or cooking?
00:40:42.000 --> 00:41:05.000
Anonymous: Oh, yes, much better. Much better. Oh, you mean that I like
working in the plant better? Gottlieb: Yes. Anonymous: Oh, yes, it was. It
was. I'm. Well, it. Traveling back and forth in wintertime down here was
hard, but still I like it better.
00:41:05.000 --> 00:41:09.000
Gottlieb: Was it just because there was more money or were there other
things you liked about it?
00:41:09.000 --> 00:41:55.000
Anonymous: Well, it was more money and the job that I had, in a way, it
was my own boss. You know that. They told me what to do, what my job was,
and I did it. And I worked in the group in four girls. I worked with me and
there's five of us. And they and I are old enough that all of us mothers.
And they treated me like a mother. And I treated them like daughters. And
we got along fine. And even now, they even take, even, even our church, we
even take Mrs. Walker. She was in my Sunday school class and many other of
the girls, and I always treated them like they were daughters. I was old
enough for their mother and they treat me like a mother.
00:41:55.000 --> 00:42:01.000
Gottlieb: Did that group of four younger women stay at the plant all the
time you were there?
00:42:01.000 --> 00:42:11.000
Anonymous: No. A couple of them left. They just got tired of working. They
left. Gottlieb: Mhm.
00:42:11.000 --> 00:42:32.000
Anonymous: Then-- now two of them is still there. After I left, I retired
and left and they're still there. I tell them stick it out because they,
they get much better benefits now I did when I were there so I tell them
stick it out and get old enough to get a pension like I did and your
pension and be much bigger. Gottlieb: Mhm. Mhm.
00:42:32.000 --> 00:42:42.000
Gottlieb: Were a Black and white women segregated in the plant at all? Did
they work in different places or were they mixed together?
00:42:42.000 --> 00:43:37.000
Anonymous: Now they, they didn't work in different places, though they was
qualified for certain jobs. They work together that-- maybe I shouldn't say
tell this but you-- this is going to be your record. They ain't going to be
for me. Gottlieb: I promise you won't. Anonymous: Okay. They had separate
restrooms down there when I first came down there, the same thing that they
had had in the South. And I had one of the girls, I call her attention to
it, but she was saying that she wouldn't go to the South. She wouldn't like
the South. I said, Why? She said, well, they got segregation down there.
And I said, yes, there. I say, they have it here. She says, oh no they
don't. I say, Yes, you do.
00:43:37.000 --> 00:44:32.000
Anonymous: And she says, no. I said, Listen. I said, when we, when we go
for lunch. Say, we goes up there, up the steps. The colored go this way.
The whites go that way to that room. And the same way with our toilets are
the same thing. I said, Now what is that? And she had never thought, you
know, so she quit. But it wasn't long 'fore somebody came from Harrisburg.
He was reporter. And he come from Harrisburg and they demand change. So
that was only, the other, uh, they worked together. Those that are
qualified to do the same work. But I enjoyed it. I had no trouble with
nobody. I know my place and I know my work.
00:44:32.000 --> 00:44:39.000
Gottlieb: And did you stay in the same position all the while you were
there, or did you change positions within the plant?
00:44:39.000 --> 00:45:32.000
Anonymous: You mean doing different jobs? Gottlieb: Yeah. Anonymous: No, I
had the same. Well, in the-- in the very beginning, I worked in somebody's
place a while. You wouldn't-- Everybody say I was taking off this, this
way. I was put a-- crane and dipped in this paint and hang on the on-- on
chains and went through a furnace and baked. Well I worked at that a little
while but I proved to be a better packer. And so I was packing and then I
had to run-- well in my union, the inside guard in the union. I had that
job a long time, so. ___________[??] I had.
00:45:32.000 --> 00:45:43.000
Gottlieb: Yeah. Did you ever see any of the other-- these other four women
in the group you worked with when you weren't working? Or did they live in
different places around Pittsburgh?
00:45:43.000 --> 00:46:43.000
Anonymous: No, I didn't have-- only see them in the plant. Some of them
live there, down there often with my-- my trauma [??] and the personnel
manager.
